Bob Carlton

xxxxxxxxxxxxxBob Carlton with his Jet Salto

Bob Carlton is not your typical glider pilot. He is part mad scientist, part entertainer and part adventurer. When I first started flying gliders, I discovered that there were basically two types of glider pilots: those who just enjoy it as a hobby, and those who are seriously competitive. Bob brings glider flying to a higher level by turning his hobby into a profession. He is a serious aviator who does not compete, but chooses to perform in air shows and entertain people all over the world.

When Bob isn’t performing in air shows he works as a mechanical designer for Sandia National Labs, where he started his career in the machine shop. He had taken machine shop courses both in high school and at Albuquerque’s Technical Vocational Institute (now called CNM), where he also taught while a student. After he graduated, he gave a friend a ride to the state employment office so that the friend could apply for a job at Sandia. While he was waiting, he decided to fill out an application. He ended up getting the job, but his friend didn’t.

Bob is a native of New Mexico. He went to Highland High, which is famous for two of its alumni, Beavis and Butthead. He married another alumnus from his high school, Laurie, in 1983. She is more than a wife; she is also his business partner. Laurie makes covers for his airplanes, assists with the air shows, creates and maintains his air show website, handles the advertising, and can often be seen on the runway watching him test his new inventions.

Laurie is very confident in Bob’s abilities and supports all his adventures. Recently at a dinner, Bob showed me his latest sketch of a new invention he is working on, a flying suit. When I asked Laurie if she was nervous about Bob flying this jet suit, she responded, “No. It’s Bob. He will be fine.”

You can read more about Bob on his website:http://www.vertigoairshows.com/home.htmlm/home.html

Interview, January 2009:

How did you get started in aviation?

My mom says that when I was about 4 she rescued me off the top of the refrigerator. I thought I could fly off. Growing up I was always building models and throwing them off the roof and thinking I could jump off with a bed sheet or something like that. I have sort of had aviation in my blood for as long as I can remember.

When did you actually start flying?

When I was 19 there was an ad in the newspaper for a hang glider for $25.00. So I bought this thing. The sail was sun rotted and all the wires were loose. It was a real mess but I repaired it on my mom’s sewing machine and with whatever hardware I had. And I basically taught myself how to fly it.

How long did you fly hang gliders?

I flew hang gliders from 79 or 80 through the mid to late 90’s.

When did you make the transition into gliders?

I actually got my power license first. Right after Laurie and I got married we lived near the airport and since I worked on base I had access to the Kirtland Aero Club. So I went there and got my airplane license.

Then I ran into Al Santilli and some of the others in the soaring club. It was a pretty straightforward operation. There weren’t a lot of rules and things that you had to do in a military flying club. And that really appealed to me along with the idea that I was getting old enough that jumping off the mountains wasn’t as much fun any more. My knees weren’t in as good shape as they use to be. So I joined up the next week and have been doing it ever since.

You have flown power planes, hang gliders and gliders. Which do you prefer?

There is nothing like hang gliding. Especially some of the places I have flown a hang glider. I have flown off the cliffs in Acapulco, Mexico and ridge soared the condominiums on the beach. There is a certain freedom with hang gliders that is hard to match with anything else. You know as you get older that sort of adrenaline…you just change. You get a little older. So the sailplanes are probably right now my favorite, although I have also been flying helicopters for about the past 4 or 5 years. And I have to say helicopters are an awful lot of fun.

What kinds of planes have you flown?

Of course I started out in a Cessna 150 and 172.
The first aircraft I owned was a Bowers Fly Baby. It’s a single seat, low wing, wood and fabric, pretty slow…65 horsepower engine, no electrical system, no starter. I bought it for about $4,000.00. That was my first excursion into tail-wheel flying. And I had someone check me out for tail-wheel. So I flew the Fly Baby for 3 or 4 years, built up some tail wheel experience. Actually, the engine on that airplane quit on me in flight, so that was my first dead stick landing into a field in South Texas.

Then I had a Skybolt Biplane that I flew in air shows. And odds and ends…a little bit of everything.

Santa Fe Air Show 2008

What got you into air shows?

I saw Manfred Radius fly a glider air show routine at the Albuquerque Balloon Fiesta sometime in the mid-eighties. That looked like a pretty interesting way to make a living. I also had seen Jimmy Franklin fly air show routines at the Balloon Fiesta for many years when I was a teenager. I couldn’t believe someone could make a living flying aerobatics in an airplane. It looked really easy and I thought I had to try it. Little did I realize exactly how much work it was going to become.

How many air shows have you done?

This is my 16th season and it has to have been 150 maybe? I don’t know.

So what is it that you like so much about air shows?

The air show business is a lot of work. But you show up in a new town, and this is an exciting event for the town. So you are meeting people when they are having fun and they are showing off the hospitality of their home town. You come in as…I use this word carefully, a little bit of a celebrity and people want you to think good things about their town so you meet them at their absolute best. And the people that I fly with in this business are just some of the craziest, most fun people in the world. So just to be able to go around the country or around the world and hang out with people like that and have people welcome you into their homes and their hometowns is just a really fun experience.

Now this isn’t your only job, you also work at Sandia Labs. Do you think you will ever quit your job at the Labs and do air shows full time?

Yeah, my days at the Labs are numbered. When I started at Sandia Labs it was a really fun place to work… but I don’t know if it is just me getting older or if things really have changed, but it seems like there is so much more bureaucracy and we aren’t nearly as cutting edge as we use to be. So I see leaving the Labs in not too many years and making some sort of flying activity including air shows into a full time living.

Mad Scientist in his lab.

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You are also an inventor. What are some of things you have designed and how did you came up with the ideas?

I was probably about 9 years old when I designed my first airplane from scratch from scrap lumber and whatever else we had around. It was a model airplane with a pretty good size wingspan but it did fly.

And I remember when I was probably 11 or 12 years old my dad worked in a sign shop. A lot of times on the weekends the guys would go down and work on personal projects.

I had been reading up on boomerangs and I thought I could make one. So I was on the belt sander with a piece of lexan plastic, it had just come out at the time, it was the hottest material on the planet. And I remember that one of my dad’s friends came by and asked “What are you working on?” I told him I was making a boomerang. They thought that was just great sport. My dad came in as they were all making fun of me and says “Well is this going to work?” And I said “Yeah.” Then I explained leading edges and trailing edges and certain angles that cause it to fly the way it does. My dad said “Come outside and fly it.” And I said, “But there are windows and cars and things all around.” And he said, “Don’t worry about it. I’ll take care of that.” So, I threw it and it came back.

So anyhow, I have a good touch for mechanical contrivances and was always fixing bicycles and motorcycles and I can’t even name all the weird things I have invented over the years.

Carousal Hangar

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How did you come up with the idea for the Carousal Hangar?

The Carousal Hangar started out as a drawing on a bar napkin. I have always been one to try to take an idea and work it into its best form, to optimize it. The standard T-hangar didn’t look efficient because you have to have paved ramps at both sides of it and you’ve got to have a lot of doors. So while it is space efficient, from a cost stand point it is very inefficient. You have to space the planes far apart.

So I started playing with the idea of some way you could get a bunch of airplanes into a hangar and get them back out again from a single door without the building costing a lot. Ned Godshall and I were kicking that around in a bar one night. A couple of months later he calls me and says “You better get to working on that because I just put the down payment on the hangar.”

We started that project in October and the first plane went into it about the middle of December. It went together pretty fast. A lot of it was sort of designed on the fly.

How many gliders does it hold?

This one holds eight. The hangar is 84 x 84 feet, or 7,056 square feet.

Tell me about your first jet glider.

Most of the crazy ideas I come up with I can remember the moment when I saw two particular things and thought this would fit together nicely…but I know Jimmy Franklin’s Jet Waco was absolutely involved in the thought process for the first jet glider. Originally I had plans for a J-85 powered Skybolt biplane, but the cost of that was going to be really high and I just wasn’t sure it was going to be worth it. Somewhere along the line I saw that the model airplane guys were starting to use jet engines. So I called around.

Then in the summer of 2001 I was talking with one company that built a jet with about 100 pounds thrust. They were fairly interested in working with me. We set up a conference call so I could talk to several of their people and some other guys that were going to sit with me and help me ask the right questions. We were sort of working a deal on the engine. That was in September of 2001. That conference call was scheduled for September 12th, and of course we all know what happened on September 11th, and they absolutely backed out. Their lawyers got cold feet. They decided it was too closely related to something that might be a terrorist attack. And they absolutely shut down and wouldn’t talk to me. So the project got put on the back burner for a couple of years.

A few years later I met Leo Bennetti-Longhini the Alisport dealer. He and I were sitting in a Waffle House watching it rain and kicking around ideas and we drew up the jet glider on a napkin (again), a Waffle House napkin this time. He said “If you buy the engines I will let you use the aircraft.” That was the beginning of the first jet glider project. That went from concept to first flight in under a year.

Where did you get the engine from? Did you buy it from Leo?

Leo was the dealer for Alisport gliders. He agreed to furnish the airframe and eventually I bought it from him.

The engines came from a model airplane engine manufacturer. They came from a company that was called AMT, Aviation Micro Turbines, but now it is called US Micro Jet.

What was the engine originally designed to do? Fly model airplanes?

Yeah, large scale, jet-fighter looking radio control airplanes.

How much thrust did it have?

I had two engines on the Silent and they had 45 pounds thrust each.

How much does a Silent weigh?

The Silent weighs about 400 pounds with the engines.

Jet Engine from Czech Republic

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Then you moved on to a big engine that you bought in Europe?

Well, I have owned a Salto glider for years. That is what I flew in air shows originally. With its V-tail it sort of lends itself well to being jet powered.

The Silent project took off and was working well. So any ideas of using the Salto got put on hold. But a couple of years ago someone sent me an email and asked me if I had heard of this engine that was built in the Czech Republic. It looked like a really nice engine so I called the factory and explained to them what I had done with the Silent. They said, “Oh no, no, no, we know who you are.” So they had heard of me and heard of what I had done and were fairly anxious to have somebody put one of these on something and get out and fly it a lot and give them some feedback on how it worked in a manned aircraft.

That project went from initial contact in about October to the first flight the following August. So that went pretty fast.

What year was that?

October of 2007 to August, 2008.

So you have been flying this for about a year?

I flew it the first time on August 1, 2008.

You did some additional modifications for special effects. Tell me about those.

In the air show business you have to have smoke. So I have wingtip pyrotechnic smoke and I also do a night show with a lot of pyrotechnics tied to the plane. So I basically fly upside down at night with the airplane on fire and get paid for it.

What’s not to like?

The airplane is not really on fire?

Parts of it are. There are an awful lot of pyrotechnic effects on the plane for that night show.

Where did you learn how to do that? Or is it just something you researched and came up with on your own?

One of the good things about working at Sandia Labs is there are a lot of crazy scientist types. A couple of those in particular, whose names I will leave out, have been instrumental in teaching me a lot about pyrotechnics, how it works and how to do it safely.

Your wife travels with you to these air shows and she appears to be someone who gives you a huge amount of support in the stuff that you do. Tell me how she has contributed to your success in your flying.

It’s actually funny. When I first started doing air shows Laurie did not think this was a good idea. The idea of hanging out at an airport every weekend just didn’t appeal to her at all. But we had a show back in 95, in Page, Arizona. It is a pretty interesting area, a lot of pretty interesting rock formations and things. We got an opportunity to do a show with the Canadian Snowbirds on a Tuesday.

The Snowbirds were between shows and they basically called and said if you will put on a show on Tuesday we will come out. I told Laurie, “This will be a lot of fun, We will go tour Bryce Canyon and things over the weekend and then go do the air show on Tuesday.” She replied “No we won’t, we will go hang out at the airport for 5 days in a row.”

So we went to the show and it actually turned out to be a really fun week. We did go see Bryce Canyon and Zion and Lake Powell. We got to the show on Monday and the Snowbirds sort of recognized that this was a test weekend. So they took Laurie and just treated her like royalty. They would let her sit in the jet when they moved from one place to another. Anytime they were going to do anything they would invite Laurie along like one of their crew. She came away that week with a whole different attitude about how much fun it could be at an air show. Ever since then she has been an integral part of the crew and the air show family.

Other than air shows do you ever get to do casual flying?

I use to do a lot soaring but the air show business keeps me pretty busy these days. I don’t get to do a lot of soaring. If I am out here (Moriarty), I am usually working on the planes and if not I am usually on my way to an air show.

I have done a fair amount of helicopter flying these past few years. Hopping rides and helping out a friend of mine, my instructor. That’s been kind of fun. It is fun to get out and fly some other things too.

Do you eventually plan to teach or just keep doing the air shows?

I like to teach people who are already pilots. I like to teach aerobatics, spins, and things the basic instructor just didn’t have time to cover before they got their license and moved on. I enjoy that aspect of teaching people how to fly but I don’t like primary instruction.

I was a hang-gliding instructor for a couple of summers and luckily I got that out of my system. I found out that I really don’t like teaching people the basics of flying. After you have been flying a long time you sort of forget how difficult it was when you first started learning. And you forget how hard it is to push your right foot down while you push your hand to the left. Or to coordinate all these things that seem so natural now.

I have watched a lot of instructors burn out after 4 or 5 years. A lot of them never get to go flying by themselves anymore. They end up leaving the sport. So I never did get my instructor rating. I don’t know if I ever will.

Tell me about the most interesting flight you have ever had.

My most interesting flight? Wow… man that’s a tough one.

It could just be the most memorable.

There are so many fascinating flights, it’s hard to sort of nail it down to one. But, if I go back through I could pick 4 or 5.

In 1986 I flew a hang-glider 102 miles from Sandia Crest to Santa Rosa. That was certainly a memorable flight.

And hang-glider flights down through Mexico, launching off volcanoes at 13,000 feet. And flying out across the top of Mexico was pretty exciting.

I have been 31,000 feet over the Sierras in California.

In a hang-glider?

No, in a sailplane.

And I have gotten to fly in so many places and so many different types of aircraft that it’s hard to go back and pick.

Did you ever have a flight that scared you?

I’ve scared myself a few times.

I remember one hang-gliding flight. I was flying out of Silverton, Colorado and there were a couple of storms coming in. The day before the storms had come in I decided not to fly. I spent a couple of hours on top of a peak above tree line with the lightning crashing all around throwing rocks down on us.

So the next day when the storm started to come in I decided I was going to bail and get back on the ground. I didn’t quite get landed before the storms hit the landing area. It was a very tight landing field and it’s nearly 9,000 feet in elevation. The wind was coming around the mountains and through the passes. I was making 50 foot excursions up and down. I was travelling backward because the wind was blowing so hard. I really wasn’t sure I was going to get on the ground safely that time. Several guys saw me coming in and ran out. On one excursion when I got close to the ground they just yanked my glider and pulled me down to the ground. That was a bit scary.

I have been up a few times where I got myself into a position I wish I hadn’t.

What did it feel like the first time you jumped off a cliff in a hang-glider?

In hang-gliding you don’t just start off jumping off a big cliff. I started on the little sand dunes just south of Albuquerque. I worked my way up to about 100 feet.

My first big launch was probably off of Tetilla Ridge, near Cochiti Lake. Very often in movies they will do a scene where the helicopter flies over a cliff and you just have this huge expanse in front of you and that is what it feels like. The view goes from just being able to see what you see on the ground to being able to see in every direction with nothing impeding. Of course with a hang-glider you hang below the glider so you see everything around you. You can actually spin around and look behind you. It is hard to describe.

Did you have flying dreams when you were a child?

I always had flying dreams, and still do. I dream of emergency procedures about once a week. I will be flying something and it will be in some situation that I have to try to figure out how to get out of.

Do you always get out of them in your dreams?

I am still here.

In your dreams.

Of course, in the dreams sometimes I actually come up with interesting ways to get out of a situation. Sometimes I magically move things…it’s a dream.

Are you rated in helicopters now?

Yeah, I have my commercial helicopter rating now.

Wow!

I am proud of that one. It is a hard one to get.

Are helicopters harder to fly than airplanes or gliders?

Helicopters are not harder to fly but a helicopter can think of 1,000 ways to kill you that an airplane never dreamed of.

Stan Roeske

Stan flying his LS3, Moriarty, NM


Stan Roeske can be described as a “Jack-of-all-trades”. I have never seen him sit still for more than a short moment. He is constantly doing something like making minor repairs on a glider, flying the tow plane, teaching someone how to fly a glider, mentoring new club members or even burning weeds in front of the club hangar.

Stan began building airplane models in 3rd grade, but didn’t experience flight until he was a junior in high school with the Civil Air Patrol (which is where he met his wife Carol.) He started flying lessons after high school, and in 1961 after 2 years of flying on and off he earned his pilot’s certificate. He then took some time off from flying to attend college. He became a member of the Albuquerque Soaring Club in 1974 and earned his instructor rating in 1993.

Stan has just under 1,000 hours in gliders- almost 2,000 flights. He also has another 800 or 900 hours in power-planes, which amounts to 1600 or 1800 tows and about 2000 flights. He has flown several kinds of gliders including the 2-33, 1-26, Lark, Blanik, Grob, 1-34, Libelle , LS3 and the Twin-Astir. He has also flown a number of power-planes including the J3 Cub, Cessna 140, 150, 172 and 182, 90 & 180 horsepower Super-Cubs, Tri-Pacer, Pitts, Decathlon, Citabria, Piper Seneca and Pawnee. Presently he owns an LS3 glider and a 1947 Aeronca “Chief” restoration project.

Stan is a kind hearted soul who has helped many people, including myself. One experience I will never forget is a day when I had a botched take-off in the Grob. I took off too early and found myself in ground effect with little control of the glider. I released and bounced away into the field next to the runway. Before I knew it everyone on the ground ran over to me and told me I need to fly again right away. I was pretty shook-up and not convinced that I should fly. Then Stan rode up on his motorcycle like a Knight-In-Shining-Armor and said “Let’s go fly.” After about an hour in the sky with Stan my confidence was restored.

Background

What kind of work did you do? Were you involved somehow in aviation?

No, I wanted to be but I was in electronics. My degree is in electrical engineering. The closest I got to it was in the 1960’s during the period of time when I wasn’t flying. I was going to college at night and was working at Sandia Labs as an instrument tech at their wind tunnel. They have a supersonic and hypersonic wind tunnel. That was really interesting stuff. That was probably the most fun I had in the almost 40 years that I worked at Sandia.

When did you take your first glider ride?

My first glider ride was with the Albuquerque Soaring Club in 1961. The club had a Schweizer 2-22 that they were keeping at 7-Bar. They had somebody with a Super Cub that was providing tows for them. They were flying off a deserted airstrip called El Rancho. It is up on the bluff in Petroglyph Park; about a ½ mile from the radio-controlled airfield.

The fellow with the Super Cub flew in and was looking around. I was the only one there. He told me that they were flying gliders and they were shorthanded. They needed someone to run wings and attach tow-ropes. I told him I didn’t have anything else to do, so he put me in the back of the Super Cub and flew me out to El Rancho.

I helped him for the rest of the morning. They said, “You have been working and helping us, would you like a glider ride?” I told them, “Yeah, I would like that. That would be neat.” So they put me in the back of the 2-22.

Herman Wente, a former member of the glider club, was my pilot. So we flew back and forth over the bluff there to see if we could find some ridge lift. We didn’t find much and landed. They put me back in the Super Cub, hooked the glider up, towed the glider and then flew me back to 7-Bar. I sort of forgot about it.

In 1974 I joined the club and had my first instructional flight with Herman Wente. We caught up 13 years later. I flew with Herman, with Al (Santilli) and two other instructors in the club to add the glider rating to my power rating.

Did your parents fly?

No. In fact my step-dad thought I was nuts. He said “Why would you want to be involved in flying? That’s silly, that’s nonsense. Go on and do something serious with your life.” He and I had a disagreement about that since before I was in first grade.

I remember going to the news reels with my parents. This was right at the tail end of WWII. You would go to the movies back then and in between the double features you would get the news reels. And here were these pictures of the war going on in Europe with fighter planes and bombers. Boy that was cool stuff to this little pre-first grader.

That was in Chicago. When we moved out here we lived under the landing pattern for Kirtland/Albuquerque International. My dad swears that I wore out two or three screen doors because every time a plane would come over our house I would be out the door to see what it was. That was in the days when I was in grade school and the National Guard was flying P-51’s, retreads from WWII. I remember watching the air-guard move from the P-51’s to the F-80 Jets and on through the entire sequence that they had.

You instruct and you are also a tow-pilot for the club. Do you ever get to fly your glider?

Rarely. That is probably the most popular joke amongst me and my friends. The LS3 has not been out of the hangar this year. It flew once last year. My partner Harry Saxton flies it less than I do and I only flew it once.

What was your most exciting-scary flight in a glider?

Probably the one exciting-scary flight, and it is just that it sticks in my mind, was one of these funny days. We actually had thermals, scattered cumulus clouds and the cloud base was about 10,000 feet (MSL.) I worked my way up to cloud base and went over to South Mountain and all of a sudden there was this big hole right there. And I wondered if there was a wave working. So I noodled out in there and there was a weak wave and I got up to about 16,000 feet (MSL.)

So here I was up at 16,000 looking down at the clouds. That was cool. I headed south down towards Estancia then turned East to head back towards Moriarty. Then I hear jet noise…and I am saying to myself, “That’s awful loud, that’s awful close. Which way do I go?” I don’t see anything. Well, it was a 727 and it was only about ½ mile away and above me. But I was where he would have least expected me to be, several thousand feet about cloud base, out there all by myself. That was a little scary.

Did you have a transponder?

No.

Do you have one now?

No, but I am saying to myself, we really need to put one in the LS3. I think transponders are needed.

Of course the new technology, we are talking about the ADSB system, the electronics in the airplanes talk to each other instead of talking to center. Which I think is better. But we’re not there yet.

Yeah, I think you need some kind of active collision avoidance.

If somebody were to give you the money to buy any plane in the world, what would you buy?

An Aviat Husky (2nd choice a Citabria) AND a Salto.

What do you think is the difference between flying a power plane and flying a glider?

The analogy that I have used is it is the difference between jumping in a ski boat and driving across the lake and jumping into a sail boat and looking at the weather and working with it to get yourself across.

I find soaring much more fun and challenging than power overall. You’re always flying the airplane. I am terribly impatient and I get bored easily. I enjoy flying power planes, I’ve got around 400 hours and something like 1600 or 1800 tows in the club’s old Super Cub and both our Pawnees. That’s fun because you’re doing something constantly. But to take a 172 and go cross-country is okay. I enjoy the views as they go by. But it doesn’t have the challenge that soaring does.


Teaching













xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxStan and Mary Hawkins

What is it that you enjoy about teaching?

I find teaching rewarding. I like to coach new pilots and offer them some of the things that I have learned. I see them improve their skills to the point that they don’t need me along.

I enjoy the one-on-one interaction. I enjoy sharing something that I do with someone else. And it really gives me a sense of satisfaction to see someone else develop those skills. And maybe I did something to help them along that road.

I am a facilitator. Teachers don’t teach. They provide the information and they provide an environment that makes it possible for that person to learn.

What is the most exciting-rewarding flight you ever had in a glider?

To me the most rewarding thing is the flying I have done working someone up to a solo. That is exciting and rewarding.












xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Stan congratulates Cliff after his solo.

Today you were able to solo someone. Tell us about it.

Cliff Goldman. Cliff has been fun to fly with. He is power rated so I jokingly said that the thing we have to work on is un-learning some of those bad habits he learned flying power planes. And that is sort-of true. That is sort-of tongue in cheek but there are some very serious differences that you have to instill in a person so that they can fly a glider safely.


Cliff was a delight to fly with. He has been a good student and actually we probably could have soloed him last weekend but there was enough cross-wind that we said no, let’s wait.

You have soloed three people this year?

Well within the last 12 months, yeah. Cliff, Mary Hawkins and Kevin Bielek.

How old is Kevin?

We soloed him on his 14th birthday.














Stan with Kevin Bielek after his first solo.

This is the second time I had a teenager solo on their 14th birthday.

The first one, I hadn’t been instructing that long and I was still learning how to be an instructor. We had a young teenager who was brought out by a mutual friend, a power pilot. She got involved with the glider club very shortly after her 13th birthday and we soloed her on her 14th birthday.

A mutual friend, Phil Philips (a pilot and realtor in Albuquerque) had the media out here. It turns out it was the same day that John Glenn flew the shuttle for his second space flight. That evening on the news they talked about John Glenn making history going into space, the congressman and former astronaut doing it again. Then they said we have another story here of a young lady making her own history here in aviation and they showed footage of her flying her first solo flight out here.

How cool!

That was cool. To me that probably was the most exciting thing relating to gliders.

Has a student ever scared you?

Actually no.

Once or twice with a student I have had to grab the controls and say “I’ve got it.”

Once one of our club members who was a rated pilot but who was terribly rusty flew with me. He wanted to give a ride to a friend but he hadn’t flown in months. So we were going to do three pattern tows together. I wasn’t happy with his landing so I was suggesting that he do his pattern a little different.

On his second flight he overshot final and started to pull the Grob too hard. If you have ever done any spin training the airplane does a funny thing. It is like you are sitting on a chair and you are about to fall off the side of the chair. If feels like you are on the verge of falling off. Here we were at 300 feet and he was trying to suck the thing around because he overshot final. I had the controls faster than I could say “I’ve got it.” I straightened it out a little bit and then said “It’s your airplane, finish the landing.” That really startled me. It was partially my own fault because I wasn’t expecting it.

Spin Training

Back when we had the Lark I offered spin training to anyone who wanted it. The Lark was an honest airplane, it would spin. It was recoverable, well behaved and very predictable.

I had taken one of our students up. What we would do is climb up high, 12 or 13,000 feet. We did a lot of briefing ahead of time. I would demonstrate a one turn spin and then I would let them try it. Then we would head back to the field. On the way back to the field I would have them slow the airplane and keep the wings level while purposely feeding in rudder. I wanted them to feel what it is like just before a stall when the plane was getting ready to spin. And that had worked well with a number of students.

On this particular flight I did a spin. He did the second one and when he stomped opposite rudder and relaxed back pressure on the stick the canopy popped open. That was exciting. Fortunately the canopy lanyard caught it and I was able to grab it and pull it back down. But it got sprung so we couldn’t latch it. We just had to hold it all the way down. The first reaction was, “Well you guys must not have locked the canopy properly.” We got it into the shop and the mechanic looked at it and said, “No, it wasn’t their fault. Those latches were pretty badly worn.” It was just the inertia of the spin. You would go ahead and spin that thing and when you put in opposite rudder and relaxed pressure on the stick, it would stop (Stan click’s his fingers) almost like that.

You mentor just about everyone who joins the club. What is your advice to new club members?

Wow, I didn’t realize I was looked at as a mentor. To me that is one of the highest compliments that you could pay somebody. I enjoy doing that.

Advice

You have to be patient. You are learning a new skill. It’s like the difficulty you had when you were a kid trying to learn how to ride a bicycle. You have to have patience and you have to stick with it. You have to have confidence in yourself that this is something you can do.

You have to invest the time and energy into it. Learning how to fly a glider is basically pretty easy. Learning to fly it well is a challenge.

I make the comparison to learning how to play a guitar. Yeah, learning to play the guitar is pretty easy. Learning how to play it well…it can be one of the more difficult instruments.

Learning to soar is pretty straight forward, it’s easy.

Bill Hill, Jim Cumiford and anyone you read about in soaring magazine that are national champions like Chip Garner, could reach that level because of a tremendous amount of dedication and practice.

Mike Abernathy

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Mike Abernathy in his Stemme Motorglider, Moriarty Airport.x

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Mike Abernathy is the Martin Scorsese of the Albuquerque glider community. He is a talented pilot, photographer, filmmaker and an avid fly fisherman and hiker. Most of the Moriarty pilots would agree that the best soaring photos they own of themselves are the ones that Mike has shot. Mike is also working closely with his nephew, Matt Murray, to produce a spectacular documentary on soaring.

Mike’s talents are as diverse as his background. He grew up in Oklahoma, New Mexico, Arizona and Southern California.

Mike is a software engineer by profession. He worked as a Manager and Principal Engineer at Rockwell International for 15 years. Then he started his own company, Rapid Imaging Software, Inc. Mike works and lives with his business partner, Carolyn Galceran, his wife.

I have flown with Mike once and witnessed his enthusiasm for the sport. He made me feel like I was a child seeing the world for the first time. His approach to flying is that of a pilot who enjoys the sport the way a hiker enjoys nature. He seems to appreciate not only the art of flying but also the incredible scenery that is only available from high above the earth.

“If soaring is an intellectual sport then Mike Abernathy should be at the top of the heap.” – Mitch Hudson

How and when did you get interested in aviation?

I was born with it. As a 5 year old all I did was draw airplanes. I wanted to fly since day zero. I was in my mid forties when I realized that it was achievable.

What type of planes have you flown?

S 2-33, G103, G102, Discus CS, T6 Texan Radial Engined warbird, Stemme S10VT.

What type of gliders do you presently own?

Discus CS, Stemme motorglider

What advice can you give pilots about purchasing a motorglider?

Honestly ask yourself before purchase – do I have the discipline to fly a motorglider safely. Am I able to not get low and bet on the engine starting? An MG pilot should never gamble on an engine start without a landing option. If you can handle that, then ask yourself if you can handle the complexity of motorgliders, without loosing the joy of soaring.

What are the pros and cons of owning a motorglider?

Cons: Complexity and cost are significant.

Pros: You can fly to anyplace and from anyplace with the right motorglider. So it has many of the benefits of owning a regular power plane. Because of the disintegrating infrastructure of soaring (fewer glider operations every year) a motorglider greatly facilitates soaring safaris. I am doing everything I can to support glider operations like Rick Kohler’s Sundance Aviation, but for long cross country flights, a motorglider helps. Also, you can fly yourself to areas of lift when it is too far or too high for the tow plane so you have few experiences with “falling out.” You can launch between other pilot’s tows (a big plus in 90 degree weather) and, if you are inclined, you can scout lift (under power) for your non motor friends. With an engine restart (even if you have had to land) a lot of the hassle of landing out is removed.

Are you a competitive pilot?

No. The only person I compete with is me. I want to get better and better. Racing is of zero interest. I enjoy the companionship of flying with other pilots, but not competition. Like all glider pilots, I race the sun, competing with the weather to go further and further.

What is it about flying gliders that you enjoy most?

Freedom. In a glider you are free in an indescribable way. A non- pilot lives in 2D. A power pilot lives in 2.5D because they are limited by their motor. But the glider pilot lives in a dimension which they cannot imagine they really live in 3D+. This freedom is for me often a spiritual experience. The cross-country soaring pilot lives in harmony with nature, and that is a powerful communion.

I also believe that soaring is a life-long commitment to learning. Flying is an activity that challenges you to get better and better for your whole life. So you will find yourself staying in shape, exercising, watching your weight, and generally taking care of yourself. You will find yourself reading books about how to be a better soaring pilot. You will find that every year of experience counts, so you will listen to the experiences of your friends to learn from them. You will relive your own flying experiences trying to glean every morsel of education from them.

I am inspired by a man named John Muratore, a NASA innovator who created the X38. He said that our society needs to explore in order to grow, and that without that our society would stagnate. I strongly believe that for these same reasons soaring is good for our society. It gives people an opportunity to learn and grow and to see our world in a whole new way. It is energy efficient and intensely engaging, challenging and fun. It is not too much to say that becoming a good soaring pilot will make you a better person overall, because it requires personal excellence at some levels.

Soaring is the safest and most affordable way to fly, but more important it is also the most fun because the challenges never end. For a power pilot, once the landing and take off and other mechanics are mastered, the learning curve flattens out while more air time is accumulated. As a power pilot once said to me “I have about 400 hours – but really it is like the same hour just repeated 400 times over.” With soaring, the evidence is clear that learning to read the sky is a lifelong quest. I am fortunate to have guys like Billy Hill, Mark Mocho, Jim Cumiford, Tim Feager, Rick Kohler, Brian Resor, and other great glider pilots who share their experiences with me, as this helps one become a better pilot.

What is your most memorable flight?

September 11, 2004. I declared an out and return to San Luis, CO and back. I was joined traveling north by Mark Mocho, Billy Hill, Howard Banks, and Al Whitesel. We all went different ways at different speeds but basically went up the Sangre De Cristos. It was my first declared 500km flight and moment of profound pride and a day of unbelievable natural beauty. It was such fun. Just the memory of days like that will get you through a lot of ground-bound days of winter. Cloud bases at 20000 feet plus and 10 kt thermals. Absolutely awe-inspiring. Below us the mountains were changing color with the season so they were green, yellow, orange and red.

Your hangar is often the hang-out for several glider pilots after a long day of soaring. What is one of the funniest stories you have heard during the "pilot cocktail hour"?

It is a great blessing to have the companionship of so many skilled, yet giftedly-humorous, pilot friends visiting our hangar. Billy Hill and Mark Mocho have made me laugh so hard that I lost my breath many times. It is hard to pick which story is best.

One afternoon we were all flying an “iffy” day and Billy had gotten low and radioed that he would have to land-out at Mountainair. Mark Mocho couldn’t resist ribbing him, even at such a tender moment. “You should thermal above your ego!” Mark suggested. As I drove off to pick up Billy, I saw that Mark himself had been forced to land-out at Estancia! The next time Mark was at the hangar with us I asked him what happened to him after such hubris.

He just looked at me and said “Those whom the gods would land-out, they first make proud.” This is a variation of a very ancient Greek proverb. I still laugh about that, and I still believe it is true.

Deor Jenson

Deor Jenson flying his old LS-4 over hwy I-40 between Cedar Crest and Albuquerque, New Mexico.

Deor Jenson is a part-time glider pilot instructor and tow pilot for Sundance Aviation in Moriarty, New Mexico. During the soaring season he lives in New Mexico and winters in Arizona.

On meeting Deor I walked away with the thought that this is an incredibly nice person. His speech and mannerisms convey that of a kind and gentle soul. This is not what you would expect from someone who spent most of their career as military fighter pilot. The stereotypical image of an arrogant, aggressive, hot-shot pilot doesn’t fly here (pun intended).

Deor began his career as a charter pilot and flight instructor to help pay for college and family expenses. After graduation, he entered the Air Force as a second lieutenant and attended pilot training, also known as "the week of 52 years." There he flew the T-37, T-38, A-7D, AT-38B and A-10. After he retired from the Air Force he worked full-time for Rick Kohler at Sundance Aviation.

Deor’s other interests have been bicycle road racing and time trials. He participated in the US Cycling Federation Masters National Championship in 1987.


How did you get interested in aviation?

I can't remember not being interested in flying. However, I can point to something specific that turned me toward a career focused on aviation. The year was 1968. I was serving in North Carolina as a missionary for the LDS Church. I became acquainted with some of the Air Force fighter pilots that were assigned to Seymour-Johnson AFB. These guys were extremely enthusiastic about their "work" and were constantly telling exciting flying stories.

When I learned that it might be possible - even for me -to fly fighters for the Air Force, I decided to pursue the goal when I returned home from my mission. College and AFROTC lead to my career in the Air Force.

You fly both power planes and gliders, what did you learn first?

My first flight training was in a Piper Cherokee 140 in 1969. I didn't earn glider ratings until 1973.

Does anyone else in your family fly?

My younger brother got his private airplane license before I started flying. He now has a "real" job and hasn't flown for quite a few years.

If you could purchase any plane, what one would you choose and why?

The first thing that came to mind was some sort of fighter like a P-51 or F-5E. But, to be honest, my 59 year old body is past the point where high sustained "G" is a good idea. Besides, flying sailplanes has been the most satisfying recreational flying I've ever done. I'd pick an ASH-26E sailplane.

What type of glider do you own?

I've had a DG-400 for a little over a year and a Standard Libelle (my second Libelle) for about a month.

Why did you purchase those particular gliders?

The DG-400 is a motorglider. That makes it very convenient on busy soaring days when a dozen other gliders are in line for a tow. I simply extend the engine, take off under my own power and find a thermal, shut down the engine and go soaring. I can also fly from airfields where a towplane is not available.

I purchased the Libelle as a winter project and also because it's such a pleasant glider to fly. The Libelle is a good value - reasonable performance and not terribly expensive.

You are both a tow pilot and an glider pilot instructor, which job do you like better?

I enjoy the variety of both jobs. It's rewarding to help a student develop safe aviation skills and attitudes and to catch the soaring bug. I also love it when Rick at Sundance asks me on a busy day to climb into one of his towplanes and help get our waiting glider pilots into the sky.

What is your most memorable flight in a glider?

It was a Veterans Day Monday on Oahu.

All the military restricted airspace was cold because of the holiday. I took a tow in my Libelle out of Dillingham Airfield (northwest tip of the island) to the nearby ridge and released at 700 feet in good ridge lift.

I gradually worked east along the ridge climbing up to the 4000 foot summit of Mount Kaala and then crossed the normally hot and hazardous mortar firing range just west of the Army's Schofield Barracks. With the restricted airspace now available, I continued south along the eastern crest of the Waiane Mountains.

The trade winds provided good ridge lift and a street of big black-bottom clouds indicated nice thermal lift.

It occurred to me that my flight path covered the same route as the Japanese attack some 60 years earlier. Soon I had a fantastic view of Peal Harbor, Hickam AFB, Honolulu, and the famous Diamond Head. What a spectacular sight! I could see a steady stream of airliners and military jets flying over the beautiful south shore of Oahu on final approach to Honolulu International.

I continued downtown to the edge of the Class B airspace before starting the return trip to Dillingham. What an enjoyable flight!

What is your most memorable flight in a power plane?

Since three-fourths of my flying time is in powered planes, I've had lots of memorable flights in aircraft with burnable ballast. It's hard to pick just one but I certainly have lots of stories to tell.


What advice do you have for new pilots?

Keep your priorities straight. In order, this is what they should be:

1. Maintain aircraft control.
2. Never hit anything in the air or allow anything in the air to hit you.
3. Never hit the ground or anything attached to the ground.
4. Always be in a position from which you can make a safe landing.


What advice do you have for new glider instructors?

Be kind and patient. Figure out how the particular student learns best and teach in such a way that you meet the students needs.

If you want to learn how to fly gliders check out Sundance Aviation.

Jeremy Patton

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Jeremy Patton in the Grob at Sundance Aviation, Moriarty, New Mexico

Jeremy Patton grew up in Moriarty, New Mexico. He learned how to fly gliders while working as a line boy for Rick Kohler at Sundance Aviation. He spent the entire summer of 2007 at Sundance Aviation learning everything he possibly could about gliders and glider pilots. Presently he is taking time off to study at Central New Mexico Community College (CNM).

What got you started flying gliders?

I had been formally introduced to sailplanes when I had my interview with Rick back in March (2007). As a kid I had seen sailplanes being towed, yet never truly understood the concept of soaring until getting the job as Line Boy. So... I began flying soon after getting the job.

Have you ever flown power planes?

Yes, but only a couple times. Once with EAA Young
Eagles when I was a young lad of 11 yrs., and the other with Rick in the Maule.

Does anyone else in your family fly?

Yeah airlines here and there. I have a couple uncles who own a Piper Cherokee that's about it.

How did you find out about the job at Sundance Aviation?

One simple phone call. I was working at Buford Steakhouse waiting and bussing tables when I decided that I didn't like that job. So what did I do you ask? I looked for a new job. Now if you are familiar with Moriarty, you know that there are maybe few jobs that pay well and are actually fun. "Which ones?" you ask, well I'll leave the guessing to you to give Moriarty the benefit of the doubt, for I only know of one; working at the airport.

What did you like about working as a line boy?

Everything for the most part. I enjoy meeting new people. I enjoy listening to all the stories, tall tales,etc. ha. I loath slow days, especially when I'm moody. Gah, I need something to do, Im depressed, ugh. ha. I learned a lot of new things, met cool people, met un-cool people, and got to FLY!

You managed Sundance for a few weeks while the owner was on vacation, what was that like?

Well, it was great experience for me. Looks good on a resume.

Would you ever want to own a glider operation?

That is a difficult endeavor to pursue. I wouldn't want to own my own glider op, but would possibly go into a partnership. Maybe someday perhaps.

What is your most memorable flight?

Out of all the flights I have in gliders, which isn't saying much, the most memorable is my first flight with Jim Harkins. "Jet Jockey" as I call him, annoyed me to a degree in which made me want to jump out of the plane when flying with him. If only I had a parachute. ha. He picked on every little flaw, making me practice whatever it was until I got it right, or- "good enough". I was so frustrated I wanted to clean his clock. And of all the days I could've flown with him, that was the day I soloed. After 5 grueling flights with the motor-mouthed fighter pilot know-it-all, I soloed. June 12, 2007. He dumped cold water on me when I got back haha.

Despite all of the mean things I said about Mr. Harkins, I love the guy. I learned so much that day, and in the months that followed, I grew to appreciate his overly-analytical approach to instruction as I witnessed men come to Sundance men, and during their time with Jim turn to putty, then leave men with better habits, haha. Jim's great.

Do you plan to buy a glider one day? If so which one would you buy?

Heck yes! When I'm wealthy enough to purchase one. I would like an ASW-20. better yet an ASW-27. That's the ultimate for me. I like the old school Labelles as well. oooh, You want to know what I really want though? That's right, an F4U supercorsair. * drool*

If you want to learn more about flying gliders contact Sundance Aviation
http://www.soarsundance.com/

Geoffrey Aiken

Geoff in the cockpit of a Grob at the Albuquerque Soaring Club in Moriarty, New Mexico.

History

Geoff Aiken has competed in various sports. He earned several medals in five different Junior Olympic games. He trained at the Colorado Springs Olympic training center. He has held regional, national and professional road racing licenses. He instructed for a variety of road racing organizations. He ran Gator Motorsports for two years with 383 members in college.

His past hobbies have been fishing, IPSC and IDPA pistol competitions, cross-country running, scuba diving, surfing, kayaking, sailing, road bicycles, alpine skiing, riding dirt bikes and street bikes, building engines, salsa dancing, full contact martial arts, rock climbing, skate boarding, basketball, baseball, tennis, soccer, racquetball and swimming.

How did you get started flying gliders?

I moved out to New Mexico from the East Coast and wasn't sure what my hobbies were going to be. Since I was in a new location there were only a few road racing teams that would still fly me out to do their races. A good friend of mine, Tommy Johnson, a co-driver, told me that I had to go soaring since I was in the best part of the country for it.

So I drove myself down to Moriarty one day and Jimmy Weir did a loop with me, then I pulled out my check book. I commuted from Los Alamos to Moriarty every weekend and slept on a couch in the hanger.

How does flying gliders compare to your previous hobby of racing cars?

Perhaps the most important difference is that I get to sleep in later. Tommy Johnson told me that his favorite difference was the fact that it wasn't such a dirty occupation.

What do you mean by dirty?

You always had oil, coolant and wore three layer fire-retardant suits soaked in sweat.

Getting back to the comparison...

I suppose that the common ground between the two involves the fact that they both require so much of your attention that you achieve a mental quiet that most people aspire to with meditation. Perhaps the best difference between the two that I find is the fact that you have the option to choose who you surround yourself with.

Are you saying that in racing you were sometimes surrounded around people you didn't like?

I wouldn't say that. I think the people you share those experiences with are the closest to you out of anyone. However, if you find yourself needing to work through the pack every weekend you're bound to have incidences that unfortunately always seem to involve the same personality types.

What is the difference between the personality type that flies gliders and the personality type that races cars?

I can't say that I see much difference at all. Especially when it concerns aerobatic or contest pilots.

What has been your favorite flight experience in a glider?

The last one that I did. And that's perhaps my favorite aspect of doing anything new.

You can find out more about Geoff on his myspace account at:
http://www.myspace.com/ufmechanic

About the Author

Diana Roberts in a Schweitzer 2-33, Sundance Aviation, Moriarty, New Mexico


I am a student pilot at Sundance Aviation in Moriarty, New Mexico. This blog started out as a school project. I wasn't sure if anyone would let me interview them but it turns out that all the pilots I asked were extremely enthusiastic. This has been a fun project and will probably continue after the semester is over.

How did I get started flying gliders ?

When I was a child I use to dream about flying around town. I would take a few steps and then be airborne. Gliding around my old neighborhoods was an incredible experience. I miss those dreams.

Last year while hiking in the Sandia mountains I ran across a few hang glider pilots. One of the pilots spent about 30 minutes patiently explaining the process of flying these giant human kites. Then he put the 80 lb kite on his back, took off running and jumped off the cliff. It was amazing to watch him transform from a average man into an eagle. The idea of hang gliding was becoming very enticing. However, there was one little glitch, I was not about to put a heavy kite on my back and jump off a cliff!

A few weeks later I was sitting in the Copper Lounge with friends having $3.00 burgers and $2.00 martinis when I had a brainstorm. Why don't I find a place in New Mexico that offers glider lessons? Gliders are real planes, not kites. You can control them the same why you control a plane. The only difference is that they don't have engines. The appeal to me was that I could soar around town looking down at my neighborhoods like I did in my dreams.

The next day I found a website for Sundance Aviation in Moriarty, New Mexico. I sent an email to them asking for more information. The owner, Rick, called me about a week later. He spent a good hour on the phone explaining to me what it would take to learn how to fly gliders. I liked him so I decided to take my lessons from Sundance. It was a good choice. The instructors are great and not only have I discovered a new hobby but I have met some wonderful people along the way.

My best flights:

Last summer while taking a lesson from Rick I discovered that he is a tenor. I love opera and one of my favorite operas is Eugene Onegin by Pushkin. I asked Rick if he could sing an aria from Eugene Onegin. He sang to me from the back seat of the Schweitzer. It was so beautiful and peaceful. Rick's girlfriend, Aimee, thinks he should offer singing glider rides. Aimee is right, the music made the experience so much richer.


My next incredible flight was this summer. A friend of mine took me on my first cross country flight in his Stemme. We flew for 6 hours without an engine. We went from Moriarty to White Sands and up to Santa Rosa and back to Moriarty. He let me fly 95% of the time. On our way to Santa Rosa we circled in a thermal with an eagle. There is nothing more beautiful than looking up and seeing an eagle in your thermal. This was definitely the best day of my summer.

If you are interested in learning how to fly gliders here are a few websites in New Mexico:

http://www.soarsundance.com/

http://www.abqsoaring.org/